Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

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    bcauchi
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  bcauchi on Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:30 pm

    Adrian, that is masterful work. it looks really great with all the lines perfectly aligned. That was not a colour scheme for the faint hearted. i think you did an excellent job. Could not have done better myself and considering all the problems you encountered, you sure came back on top. Great work.

    AdriaN
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  AdriaN on Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:38 am

    Embarassed Im glad you all like my work
    A lot still to go!

    iCocker
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  iCocker on Tue Nov 16, 2010 8:35 am

    Belated mate, but Prosit with a capital P, very well done ... this kind of schemes are damn tricky!
    Maybe a tip I can give to solve the decal 'transparency' issue is to mask the area that is gonna be placed upon be given a base coat of white, but you have to live with the issue that it is almost impossible to replicate the exact colour of a printed matter and a painted matter, you might go near which IMHO you managed but never can be exact as the process of making for both materials is different!
    Well done again, nice to see a colourful subject ...

    J.Fenech
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  J.Fenech on Tue Nov 16, 2010 9:17 pm

    Nicely done, well done! Let's see it finished

    Aldo
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  Aldo on Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:34 pm

    Wow! That's some decal job alright.

    Very nice work Ad.

    Dottore
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    Well done!

    Post  Dottore on Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:45 pm

    Admire the way you didnt just dump the model with all the problems you encountered...believe me I know something about hiccups and problems in any stage of model building!!!

    Keep posting!

    Dottore

    alexbb
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  alexbb on Thu Nov 18, 2010 10:45 am

    keep up the good work.

    skyhigh
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  skyhigh on Thu Nov 18, 2010 2:20 pm

    Hey.. Hey.. Adrian, now that's what I call a challange in modeling ...welldone my friend beautiful finish... cheers

    ascomt
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  ascomt on Thu Nov 18, 2010 7:19 pm

    Hi Adrian

    Great work mate. Amazing paint job Twisted Evil. I admire your perseverance - had it been me, that Mystere is a long gone mystery by now. Mad Crying or Very sad

    Prosit again and keep 'em comin'

    Alex

    Ray
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  Ray on Fri Nov 19, 2010 5:38 am

    They are all pulling your leg Adrian as this is the lousiest job I've ever seen on a model Sad it looks a real mess Laughing

    Honestly AdriAn, you outdid yourself with this one!! I never fathomed that you had it so much in you Twisted Evil

    WELDONE & KEEP IT UP!!!!!!!

    in nannu pec
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  in nannu pec on Fri Nov 19, 2010 1:52 pm

    Well done Adrian.....very crisp and finely finished paint job.....
    In nannu What a Face

    AdriaN
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  AdriaN on Fri Nov 19, 2010 2:44 pm

    Sad Sad Sad Sad Sad
    all these nice comments! Embarassed (did you all team up to send these motivational comments?) Razz

    It is a very difficult model. probably tougher than the Panther. not only the kit.. but mainly the paint.
    I challange someone to build it! Twisted Evil Basketball (its only 6 ewri)

    The model:
    I have retouched that big gash on the tail, some red on the spine, i also ran some thinned white on the spine to darken the white.. it worked slightly. Now doing the wheels. Also need to wet sand, gloss, panel wash, gloss.. & decide on THE FINAL SET UP! pale

    bcauchi
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  bcauchi on Mon Nov 22, 2010 8:39 am

    No, we did not team up, you bloody deserve it unless you manage to screw it all up somehow. But to get over all the problems you encountered and end up with such a nice model, i doubt it.

    AdriaN
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  AdriaN on Mon Dec 20, 2010 2:14 pm

    I put this build a side because i was busy wth the F84, also i stopped because of the panel washing problem here:
    http://ipmsmalta.forumotion.net/t1067-panel-washing-question

    Advice i got:
    use W&N oils
    dont use use W&N oils they clump too
    change thinner
    W&N distilled artists turpentine
    try water colours (?)
    thin the oil more and doing lighter washes
    Promodeller washes can be crap/good
    AK/Mig pigments (worries me because they are enamel based meaning once dry, you cant remove them)

    Pretty confusing. Not very economical to buy & go through all Evil or Very Mad

    Lately i tried watercolours (in the tube) expecting a bad result, & i was amazed that it went well! when it dried it didnt clump up & the dried wash on my palette dried nicely & opaque and did not dry grainy (like oils) I need to experiment more. i had to force the wash in rather than letting it flow. i dont know how it will work on flat surfaces yet. Ill also try using dish soap to break viscosity. study

    bcauchi
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  bcauchi on Mon Dec 20, 2010 2:42 pm

    I don;t know if i gave you my opinion before but i use acrylic paints which is in fact a glorified watercolour. This works.

    clioguy
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  clioguy on Mon Dec 20, 2010 6:13 pm

    Adrian, from the pic of the oil paint you submitted it seems that those aren't Artists Oil Colours (I may be wrong....)

    I use Norma fine artist oil colour (bought from Sistins in Sliema) thinned with White spirit.

    HTH

    iCocker
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  iCocker on Mon Dec 20, 2010 8:32 pm

    Adrian


    All washes are meant to stay, so no matter what you use being oils or AK/MIG they give some time to correct before they dry but once they dry and try to remove them you end up doing a mess as all leave residue behind ... never heard of any washes that you can remove after they dry! Both oils and enemel base washes give you time to correct while working that is why they are much better then any acrylic washes ... personally I start with lighter colours and keeping the dark for the last and when I am totally sure I have to use it ... hope it helps buddy! Personally if you like to have a constant colour mix and maybe tight with time I go for a safe bet of AK washes ... these are enemel based and give you time to correct ...

    Brian - acrylics are not glorified watercolours, those are sintetic and their properties are something totally different ...

    bcauchi
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  bcauchi on Tue Dec 21, 2010 4:39 pm

    Sorry Ivan you are right but what i mean to say is that they are applied just like water colours, well at least that is how i use them. It is also easy to remover the excess paint on the panels with light wet sanding with 1200 paper. However, whatever wash you use on an aircraft, the secret is to apply a good protective coat of gloss varnish before.

    iCocker
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  iCocker on Tue Dec 21, 2010 7:41 pm

    Yep varnish is essential especially if you just need washes in the cavities ...

    AdriaN
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  AdriaN on Tue Dec 21, 2010 8:53 pm

    Dont worry its been sprayed 2 strong protective layers of Klear Laughing

    I do not like the idea of wet sanding the dried excess paint off. its a big risk. Also ive used acrylics & they dry quick and once dry cannot be rubbbed off freely.

    ivan oils give you a few days to correct. they take a week to dry totally. you can go back to it 3 days later and rub it off with your finger! enamels.. an hr?

    I will experiment with water colours for now. i like the results. does khobbies have mig? which colours are best for washes for aircraft? black & burnt umber?

    bcauchi
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  bcauchi on Wed Dec 22, 2010 8:44 am

    Adrian, i always wet sand my models after washes, it also puts right any defects in the paint finish and continues to enhance the smoothness of the finished surface. That is why i prefer acrylics for washes. When i used to use oils, they required more sanding to remove the excess and that resulted in some bad experiences sometimes with the colour being removed although i would have had multiple coats of gloss varnish. with acrylics, this does not occur, the excess is easily removed with minimal sanding effort.

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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  iCocker on Wed Dec 22, 2010 10:35 am

    AdriaN wrote:Dont worry its been sprayed 2 strong protective layers of Klear Laughing

    I do not like the idea of wet sanding the dried excess paint off. its a big risk. Also ive used acrylics & they dry quick and once dry cannot be rubbbed off freely.

    ivan oils give you a few days to correct. they take a week to dry totally. you can go back to it 3 days later and rub it off with your finger! enamels.. an hr?

    I will experiment with water colours for now. i like the results. does khobbies have mig? which colours are best for washes for aircraft? black & burnt umber?

    Adrian oils leave a residue no matter what you do, I use a mix 95% Turp with 5% oil to make filters, the idea is to change and tie up colours of the base - no matter what you do and varnish you make oils have a very strong pigment and leave a trace. If your wash take so much days to cure means you are not mixing the right products. A wash will only take an hour to dry, especially if mixed with Artist English Turpentine [it smells]. That is ample time to adjust, never correct ... I state again no matter what you do and how thin mix shall be the pediment colour will always change to a differenbt hue ... and plaese do not commit eternal sins with removing washes with fingers or cotton you will leave trace, if you need controlled was buy a good pointed short bristled round sable paint brush and do pin washing, that for me is the most controlled effect ... as always start with the lighter mix going up to the darker ... as for varnishes as I am an AFV modeller I prefer satin as it gives better control for filters and washes, gloss might be too flat a surface to control ...

    As for colours I personally like earth colours and avoid black by itself, pigment very strong. Personally I like Raw Umber, Burnt Umber and Sepia, depends the base colours what they are ... as for acrylics I have my reservation on using them for washes but then again it has been achieved by others ... it's only experimenting and understanding your material buddy ... experiemnt and practice, that's the secret!

    AdriaN
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  AdriaN on Fri Feb 04, 2011 2:07 pm

    Ok so ive been experimenting with W&N water colours with pleasing results! They have very good/fine pigment and dont come out all 'dusty' like oils. I always add washing liquid to help them spread over plastic. ALSO tey dry quickly and if you dont like what you see... water and a brush and it all comes off Laughing



    This is an experiment i made with 'vandyke brown'. on the left we have a thick wash and on the right a light, heavily thinned wash. As we can see it always gives good coverage, no dotty finish. Laughing


    This is a test with water colours. left is a light wash while right is havier wash. not bad Laughing Im finding it difficult to give a V.LIGHT wash Evil or Very Mad Im experimenting with black & sepia colours.






    Also, back with oils, i tried thinning with turpentine & white spirit to see how the thinners would react with the oils.

    The one thinned with T turpentine dries all grainy. The one thinned with WS White Spirit gave better coverage. It seems WS breaks down the pigment better. Also the Turp took longer to dry, and when i moved the test area around the oil with T moved around while the WS oil didnt move! On the right we have heavily thinned oil with WS.

    After all this testing & having thougt i had broken the mystery, i went ahead with panel washing with WS & oil... and the SAME problem happened.. drying all grainy so i give up with oils Evil or Very Mad

    AdriaN
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  AdriaN on Fri Feb 25, 2011 2:26 am

    UPDATE


    Ive been trying to finish this bird off lately. Almost done!
    Weathering, landing gear and final coating done. cheers


    I used plasticard for the first time. started off by using it to close off a gap in the inside of the front gear followed by weights. I used it on a gear door and on a landing gear because the planes wing was lower on one side, so i removed the wheel and put 2 layers of plasti card!


    Nose



    Door



    Wheel




    Wheels




    FAR from easy to fit. I used a mix of CA, PVA and glue to get these bad fitting wheels/doors on!







    Nav Lights

    My usual party trick. Silver- acrylic gloss- glass paint- Acrylic gloss (look better/lit in a sunny place)






    Touching up time Evil or Very Mad





    The Model now






    AdriaN
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    Re: Dassault MD-454 Mystere IV A ''Patrouille de France'' (Revell 1:72)

    Post  AdriaN on Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:44 pm

    Ive been working on the model, trying to finish it off for the expo.


    This is the canopy. nicely masked panel lines, which in the end is for nothing since it will have a cover over it.





    Canopy cover progress. I still need to cut it to shape.




    Canopy stuck on. HORRIBLE and out of scale. Looks like a TOY? This is mainly why i am going to place a canopy cover over it, to cover it up Rolling Eyes










    I am thinking about its final set up/base and since i am representing it as a 'retired aircraft' i am going to place it on turf, placed on 3 concrete slabs which i will make out of plasticard. I prefer green turf (the colours will stand out more) rather than boring concrete gray squares.

    Tipo this:






      Current date/time is Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:50 pm