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Sounds fishy to me but looks what is the National Champion, a fantasy steam monobike ... has a figure and is fantasy is this some kind of message to me ; )
Iv
Iv
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Noel Petroni
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Telford 2012 Report
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Ray- Best in Show
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Xi Pjacir min jaf Marco kemm ha jinharaq u jghid "ara f'hiex spiccajna l-IPMS Xi Pjacir" 
Joking apart, I honestly don't know what to say since I can't view any other entries
so can't see what this model was up against 
As we all know, sometimes a BoS could be debatable even more then it should be, as it is a matter of opinion of a few grumpy judges
& not the general consensus 
My Humble Judgement whenever/almost whenever I see a BoS, is "How the heck I didn't think of that myself beforehand
" & thus I envy any BoS as a Mortal Human of weak & sinful flesh & blood 
Again, I don't know what happened at IPMS since the year 2000 when we last graced the greenery of England, so maybe they are overdue for an Honours Overhaul by the real Society for Scale Modellers
Joking apart, I honestly don't know what to say since I can't view any other entries
so can't see what this model was up against As we all know, sometimes a BoS could be debatable even more then it should be, as it is a matter of opinion of a few grumpy judges
& not the general consensus My Humble Judgement whenever/almost whenever I see a BoS, is "How the heck I didn't think of that myself beforehand
" & thus I envy any BoS as a Mortal Human of weak & sinful flesh & blood Again, I don't know what happened at IPMS since the year 2000 when we last graced the greenery of England, so maybe they are overdue for an Honours Overhaul by the real Society for Scale Modellers
skyhigh- Best in Show
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Boycott Boycott Boycott Boycott ..........
Well IPMS Nationals turned out to be Model eng...nothing new ..like we have here.....
Well IPMS Nationals turned out to be Model eng...nothing new ..like we have here.....
Last edited by skyhigh on Sun Nov 11, 2012 9:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
Gordon- Gold
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http://ipmsuk.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=smw2012&action=display&thread=10318
skyhigh- Best in Show
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Gordon wrote:http://ipmsuk.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=smw2012&action=display&thread=10318
LOUIS........Bring out your ships........
iCocker- Best in Show
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Gordon wrote:http://ipmsuk.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=smw2012&action=display&thread=10318
My reaction judging from fotos ... Thumbs up for the best armour and best figure!!!!!!
Still I am buffled with the BOS, not that it is not a well deserved job, but have we already passed this marketing tool of atracting a different group of modellers to an already established competition?
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iCocker wrote:Gordon wrote:http://ipmsuk.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=smw2012&action=display&thread=10318
My reaction judging from fotos ... Thumbs up for the best armour and best figure!!!!!!
Still I am buffled with the BOS, not that it is not a well deserved job, but have we already passed this marketing tool of atracting a different group of modellers to an already established competition?
If these were the "best" that were up for grabs, then the BoS was UNBEATABLE & in a league of its own IMHO
As I said, they need a REAL SSM Injection fil-VINA ASAP
skyhigh- Best in Show
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Any member of wigy interest check this out...
http://www.scaleplasticandrail.net/kaboom/index.php/all-other-subjects/news/83-kit-news/1695-the-latest-from-zoukei-mura-almost-smw-2012
http://www.scaleplasticandrail.net/kaboom/index.php/all-other-subjects/news/83-kit-news/1695-the-latest-from-zoukei-mura-almost-smw-2012
in nannu pec- Best in Show
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skyhigh wrote:Gordon wrote:http://ipmsuk.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=smw2012&action=display&thread=10318
LOUIS........Bring out your ships........
jiena nahdem qieghed...
in nannu
Gordon- Gold
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http://www.tartanpaint.info/2012/11/10/telford-ipms-2012/#
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freinds
this is not a model engineered vehicle it is purely a fantasy peice, at the momement there is a lot of hype over steam punk fantasy based in the victorian era. it is growing ever more popular especially with young modellers, with french and u.s. sculptors and producers taking the lead, we have smart max, smog1888 and warmachine producing models of this type and various other companies comming up with game modules. ipms was never the monopoly of the "normal model subjects" fantasy and sci fi have always been present, and as most of us who have gone to various competitions around europe and us know, fantasy and sci fi are ever growing
btw if im correct its a scratchbuilt piece
this is not a model engineered vehicle it is purely a fantasy peice, at the momement there is a lot of hype over steam punk fantasy based in the victorian era. it is growing ever more popular especially with young modellers, with french and u.s. sculptors and producers taking the lead, we have smart max, smog1888 and warmachine producing models of this type and various other companies comming up with game modules. ipms was never the monopoly of the "normal model subjects" fantasy and sci fi have always been present, and as most of us who have gone to various competitions around europe and us know, fantasy and sci fi are ever growing
btw if im correct its a scratchbuilt piece
Ray- Best in Show
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I'm viewing the pics from Gordon's link....there's a Russian Tank B/95 something (the number on the turret 
) & it is MUCH BETTER then the AFV Champion IMHO
IMHO only a few handful of up to standard models
The time for the REAL & ORIGINAL SSM is OVERDUE by more then a DECADE
) & it is MUCH BETTER then the AFV Champion IMHO IMHO only a few handful of up to standard models
The time for the REAL & ORIGINAL SSM is OVERDUE by more then a DECADE
iCocker- Best in Show
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Alex, I know about this trend of Victorian Steam machines, but felt from first impact it was chosen to atract a new genre of competitors to the venue ... they know how challenging the Wrahammer convensions is, on the other hand seeing the other models [judging from fotos] I think this deserved to win. By the way it is scratch, not sure from the sexy figure though ...
Last edited by iCocker on Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
alexbb- Best in Show
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iCocker wrote:Alex, I know about this trend of Victorian Steam machines, but felt from first impact it was chosen to atract a new genre of competitors to the venue ... they know how challenging the Wrahammer convensions is, on the other hand weeing the other models [judging from fotos] I think this deserved to win. By the way it is scratch, not sure from the sexy figure though ...
i tend to agree with you on the fact that it was chosen as an advert to the hobby and quite frankly i don not blame them. in the western world our hobby is dying from old age and if you do not attract some young bloods it will disappear in 25 years time. and frankly from the photos i have seen it deserves the prize even though i have not as yet seen photos of models from renowned modellers whom i am sure where there. on the other hand i have seen complaints about the judging and plenty.
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On facebook many are complaining about judging and much more about the very bad lighting system ... but seems it is the norm!
Noel Petroni- Gold
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Judging............... To form an opinion or estimation of after careful consideration
To determine or declare after consideration or deliberation.
One who makes estimates as to worth, quality, or fitness
I think judging in scale models has been a dilemma and will remain for many years to come. How do you judge art if art is unique.
So judging really is taken away from the actual word and meaning of "judging". It seems that judges, when viewing an art piece are influenced by fashion, pressure to make a difference and pure instant feeling triggered by the aura of the event.
In short, no art piece is judged in it's true word because many factors obscure the judges ability to look deeply into the art piece.
So just enjoy modelling!
To determine or declare after consideration or deliberation.
One who makes estimates as to worth, quality, or fitness
I think judging in scale models has been a dilemma and will remain for many years to come. How do you judge art if art is unique.
So judging really is taken away from the actual word and meaning of "judging". It seems that judges, when viewing an art piece are influenced by fashion, pressure to make a difference and pure instant feeling triggered by the aura of the event.
In short, no art piece is judged in it's true word because many factors obscure the judges ability to look deeply into the art piece.
So just enjoy modelling!
Ray- Best in Show
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Noel Petroni wrote:Judging............... To form an opinion or estimation of after careful consideration
To determine or declare after consideration or deliberation.
One who makes estimates as to worth, quality, or fitness
I think judging in scale models has been a dilemma and will remain for many years to come. How do you judge art if art is unique.
So judging really is taken away from the actual word and meaning of "judging". It seems that judges, when viewing an art piece are influenced by fashion, pressure to make a difference and pure instant feeling triggered by the aura of the event.
In short, no art piece is judged in it's true word because many factors obscure the judges ability to look deeply into the art piece.
So just enjoy modelling!
Well said Noel
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Sorry guys but I do not agree, ART is judged, it is judged by the patron and by the viewer, we are overwhelmed with everything called ART but finally not everything is a creation ... some are copies, others are following of other fashionable style etc etc ... yet all have their merits and yet not everyone's cup of tea to like!
On a different note is what I do not like is to compare styles and work with each other. No one can challenge Model A against Model B that is bad judging but everyone has an eye to agree what a model is worth what ... yet that is my opinion. Work are put on a table to be critisized, good or bad ... obviously teh artist does not always agree with the opinion yet that is the world!
Like comparing Michalengelo's David with the Fallic monument in the Luqa roundabout ... both are artpieces and both have their own merits and meanings!
Iv
On a different note is what I do not like is to compare styles and work with each other. No one can challenge Model A against Model B that is bad judging but everyone has an eye to agree what a model is worth what ... yet that is my opinion. Work are put on a table to be critisized, good or bad ... obviously teh artist does not always agree with the opinion yet that is the world!
Like comparing Michalengelo's David with the Fallic monument in the Luqa roundabout ... both are artpieces and both have their own merits and meanings!
Iv
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iCocker wrote:Sorry guys but I do not agree, ART is judged, it is judged by the patron and by the viewer, we are overwhelmed with everything called ART but finally not everything is a creation ... some are copies, others are following of other fashionable style etc etc ... yet all have their merits and yet not everyone's cup of tea to like!
On a different note is what I do not like is to compare styles and work with each other. No one can challenge Model A against Model B that is bad judging but everyone has an eye to agree what a model is worth what ... yet that is my opinion. Work are put on a table to be critisized, good or bad ... obviously teh artist does not always agree with the opinion yet that is the world!
Like comparing Michalengelo's David with the Fallic monument in the Luqa roundabout ... both are artpieces and both have their own merits and meanings!
Iv
Well said Ivan
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iCocker wrote:Sorry guys but I do not agree, ART is judged, it is judged by the patron and by the viewer, we are overwhelmed with everything called ART but finally not everything is a creation ... some are copies, others are following of other fashionable style etc etc ... yet all have their merits and yet not everyone's cup of tea to like!
On a different note is what I do not like is to compare styles and work with each other. No one can challenge Model A against Model B that is bad judging but everyone has an eye to agree what a model is worth what ... yet that is my opinion. Work are put on a table to be critisized, good or bad ... obviously teh artist does not always agree with the opinion yet that is the world!
Like comparing Michalengelo's David with the Fallic monument in the Luqa roundabout ... both are artpieces and both have their own merits and meanings!
Iv
Well....... this is how I see it....... every art is a creation UNLESS it is an exact copy WHICH is in fact art in itself!
Mig shows us art in painting armour and we try to copy his technique... after all that is how art is formed by following up from the creation of others. If I had to copy a model of Mig down to the last tiny detail........ than I'm good and I created art... maybe not original but still art because I managed to achieve the exact technique where others might have failed.
If I present an exact copy of Mig .... say at Euro... I'll probably not get anything BUT in actual fact didn't I create art from my own hands? It did not come out from a photocopy machine.... I did it.
Ivan, I believe everything is a creation, even copies. Some artist's make abstract art and are applauded for their originality and others artists look at the landscape around and copy what they see onto a white canvas and they are applauded...... some artists make exact copies of famous art and are also applauded fro their ability.
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Noel Petroni wrote:iCocker wrote:Sorry guys but I do not agree, ART is judged, it is judged by the patron and by the viewer, we are overwhelmed with everything called ART but finally not everything is a creation ... some are copies, others are following of other fashionable style etc etc ... yet all have their merits and yet not everyone's cup of tea to like!
On a different note is what I do not like is to compare styles and work with each other. No one can challenge Model A against Model B that is bad judging but everyone has an eye to agree what a model is worth what ... yet that is my opinion. Work are put on a table to be critisized, good or bad ... obviously teh artist does not always agree with the opinion yet that is the world!
Like comparing Michalengelo's David with the Fallic monument in the Luqa roundabout ... both are artpieces and both have their own merits and meanings!
Iv
Well....... this is how I see it....... every art is a creation UNLESS it is an exact copy WHICH is in fact art in itself!
Mig shows us art in painting armour and we try to copy his technique... after all that is how art is formed by following up from the creation of others. If I had to copy a model of Mig down to the last tiny detail........ than I'm good and I created art... maybe not original but still art because I managed to achieve the exact technique where others might have failed.
If I present an exact copy of Mig .... say at Euro... I'll probably not get anything BUT in actual fact didn't I create art from my own hands? It did not come out from a photocopy machine.... I did it.
Ivan, I believe everything is a creation, even copies. Some artist's make abstract art and are applauded for their originality and others artists look at the landscape around and copy what they see onto a white canvas and they are applauded...... some artists make exact copies of famous art and are also applauded fro their ability.
Again well said Noel
Honestly I am enjoying this exchange of views & debates as a shed of light on how we should percieve ART
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Ray wrote:Noel Petroni wrote:iCocker wrote:Sorry guys but I do not agree, ART is judged, it is judged by the patron and by the viewer, we are overwhelmed with everything called ART but finally not everything is a creation ... some are copies, others are following of other fashionable style etc etc ... yet all have their merits and yet not everyone's cup of tea to like!
On a different note is what I do not like is to compare styles and work with each other. No one can challenge Model A against Model B that is bad judging but everyone has an eye to agree what a model is worth what ... yet that is my opinion. Work are put on a table to be critisized, good or bad ... obviously teh artist does not always agree with the opinion yet that is the world!
Like comparing Michalengelo's David with the Fallic monument in the Luqa roundabout ... both are artpieces and both have their own merits and meanings!
Iv
Well....... this is how I see it....... every art is a creation UNLESS it is an exact copy WHICH is in fact art in itself!
Mig shows us art in painting armour and we try to copy his technique... after all that is how art is formed by following up from the creation of others. If I had to copy a model of Mig down to the last tiny detail........ than I'm good and I created art... maybe not original but still art because I managed to achieve the exact technique where others might have failed.
If I present an exact copy of Mig .... say at Euro... I'll probably not get anything BUT in actual fact didn't I create art from my own hands? It did not come out from a photocopy machine.... I did it.
Ivan, I believe everything is a creation, even copies. Some artist's make abstract art and are applauded for their originality and others artists look at the landscape around and copy what they see onto a white canvas and they are applauded...... some artists make exact copies of famous art and are also applauded fro their ability.
Again well said Noel
Honestly I am enjoying this exchange of views & debates as a shed of light on how we should percieve ART
I concur with Ray ...both well spoken Noel and Ivan....to me modelling is creativity...art...one's expression of himself in a model but above all it's a passion for the serious modeller. I for one have tried various techniques namely fom Mig...Kostas...and many others but I feel the pleasure of fulfilment in finishing a model with techniques I developed myself throughout the years...good or bad...the techniques I feel comfortable working with....IMHO whether a model turns out good or bad it's always an object of creativity and satisfaction for the modeller once finished...Passion that's the most important thing !..
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definition of art Encyclopædia Britannica.
"the use of skill and imagination in the creation of aesthetic objects, environments, or experiences that can be shared with others"
now everyone can interpret this in any way he or she wants
"the use of skill and imagination in the creation of aesthetic objects, environments, or experiences that can be shared with others"
now everyone can interpret this in any way he or she wants
iCocker- Best in Show
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But I think you [or me] misunderstood the whole argument, we all agree it is art, but art is an expresiion and can it be judged or not ... in my opinion yes it can, as there are artists and artists, and does not mean that famed artist always produce the same result and same output ... infact one can also job from one job to another from the same artist ...
On another note looks the BOS for Telfor was won by an Italian, seems they took everything this year ...
On another note looks the BOS for Telfor was won by an Italian, seems they took everything this year ...
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So shall we change the club name to SSA Society for Scale Artists?
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